In my opinion, a stream of comments on a blog should typically come to a halt as a result of their own momentum. I have never liked the policy of “cutting off” the right to comment on any post, and this is why I do not close commenting here.

Now, granted, I do respect the alternative. Sometimes - as it has been said - a discussion is merely going in circles, and it has become a matter of two people (or groups, as the case may be) putting forth two separate alternatives to some sort of problem or issue, neither of which can be certified to be any better or more grounded in fact than the other. Or, perhaps, compelling arguments can be made for both sides regardless of whether these arguments are tied to the reality of the situation.

In these scenarios, I do understand that it may be appropriate to acknowledge that an impasse has been reached and no further discussion is worthy of merit. I respect that. I also respect the right of a blog owner to then create a summative comment restating both opinions and acknowledging the impasse.

However, I think it is slightly unfair to put forth new information or arguments when creating a concluding comment. So it was in the Strange ELPE Decision

Had the final comment been simply the latter half of what currently exists, I would not have had a problem with it. However, the material in bold (below) is making further arguments for one side, and then closing the comments is preventing response from the other:

Binks

I think this has reached the end of its usefulness, so I’m going to sum up.

**For writing it; I think that at least if the test is done earlier, it’s one less thing to worry about when other exams come up (even if it’s marked later - they can sit in a box). Arts uses AL as its “home base” for frosh week; I imagine other faculties have similar situations; we also do services tours - so the frosh are out and about getting landmarks and touring special places on campus. So long as ample “hooplaw” is made about the locations for ELPE writing, it doesn’t seem like it’d be that difficult to pull off.

They could also run ELPE writing at any other time during the term (it’s not like people can cheat by “knowing the answers” for the ELPE). I disagree that it must be done in December.

Since Stream 4 is being phased out, that looks like a real red herring to me. It’s a point that is already irrelevant, or will be so soon.**

However, our basic points have been thus: Math and Eng have more people who fail ELPE than Arts does Arts students need English to even consider passing a course; Math and Eng could probably scrape by

I don’t think we’re disagreeing at all with either of these points - where we disagree is in the relative importance of these situations. I think our positions on all of this is pretty clear.

Thanks for your input, but this is clearly an impasse; we’ll have to agree to disagree here.

To that end, I am going to respond to the additional comments made.

Granite

Your alternatives ignore already stated information.

If the ELPE is written earlier and left to stagnate, it serves no added benefit. Students will not be able to get enrolled in the Fall terms Writing Clinic (which has limited spaces) which means that writing it before December has no added benefit regardless.

If the ELPE is written in different locations across campus, then the ELPP and the Writing Clinic will have to stretch their budget to thin to get people to proctor at all of these various locations, resulting in an administrative and financial nightmare.

If the ELPE is written at any other time during the term, it does not remove a collision with some sort of assignment or project for some group of people. The fact of the matter is, students are preoccupied with readings, essays, projects, presentations, and weekly assignments all throughout the term. Furthermore, class schedules are so varied that scheduling ELPE sessions would be next to impossible. Frosh Week and the Final Exam period are the only feasible times because the potential for conflict is minimal.

As you say, there is no way to “know the answers” or “cheat” for the ELPE. Similarly, there is no possible way to study for it. So, why not have it during December for some? It does not require any additional preparation that would interfere with Final Examination studying. Furthermore, the people writing the ELPE in December are likely to have the easiest time with the test.

Stream 4 likely had more of an impact in the past than it does currently. This is true. It has become an irrelevant point (or will be soon).

As said before, the current system for the administration of the ELPE offers the least amount of conflict possible and allows the entire program to operate as smoothly as possible with minimal negative impact on students.

Now that I have countered the new information that you put forward, I’m going to leave it at that. I haven’t really presented a new argument. This is mostly just applying elements of the ELPP that were brought up in previous comments. If you feel the need to provide some sort of rebuttle, feel free to do so in my comments.

Regardless of whether anyone reads this, I feel much better having been able to have said my piece rather than being cut off from making any further comment.